Curse

upier · Jan 05, 2010, 08:56 AM // 08:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

I prefer more damage slots and two "keep alive" players maximum. Besides, with more damage, the faster the enemies fall. The faster they fall, the less protection you need.

Simple, but effective.

When playing with hench?
What hench is going to be better than the two monks, the mesmer and the earth hench? Or better yet, what hench will suck less?

It's a difference when you have 8 bars that you can control, where you choose the best options and when playing with hench where you pretty much pick out the guys that present the least threat to your own team.

MercenaryKnight · Jan 05, 2010, 09:04 AM // 09:04

I agree with the concept of 2 main healers and then general support skills thrown on other damage builds. Using a 3rd slot to spam protection spells is kind of counter productive. Especially if you run save yourselves on your character. For an ER healer you could basically put a copy of protective spirit and aegis on like 2 chars for support (say discord for example) and still have the same damage.

Now if you could use 1 healer and 1 ER and cover all the damage then it'd be worth while.

The Josip · Jan 05, 2010, 09:41 AM // 09:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

When playing with hench?
What hench is going to be better than the two monks, the mesmer and the earth hench? Or better yet, what hench will suck less?

It's a difference when you have 8 bars that you can control, where you choose the best options and when playing with hench where you pretty much pick out the guys that present the least threat to your own team.

I'm by no means hench expect, but why mesmer hench? The skillbar looks as if he's going to stand idle most of the time. Why not Zho instead? Or even warrior a bit buffed with splinter or something. And why not Paragon instead of monk? A bit of healing but also dmg.

I never use 3-monk backline in general PvE (if we dont count MM with Dwayna's kiss and Sorrow). Might be ok in dungeons, I dunno. Elsewhere I prefer more firepower, especially since some missions and vanquishes and quests I do with C+space with HH doing everything while I do something else.

upier · Jan 05, 2010, 12:27 PM // 12:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

I'm by no means hench expect, but why mesmer hench? The skillbar looks as if he's going to stand idle most of the time. Why not Zho instead? Or even warrior a bit buffed with splinter or something. And why not Paragon instead of monk? A bit of healing but also dmg.

The problem with hench that demand a line of sight is that they do not move if they are obstructed. They are also more easily shut down.
Melee AI is pretty poor - definitely worse than caster AI.
The para bar is sub-par healing with next to 0 damage.

If we had full hero parties - this would be a completely different discussion.

Jeydra · Jan 05, 2010, 01:44 PM // 13:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

What hench is going to be better than the two monks, the mesmer and the earth hench? Or better yet, what hench will suck less?

So you pick the two Monks, Mesmer and Earth henchmen and then run three offensive / semi-offensive heroes. Why not?

Carinae · Jan 05, 2010, 11:42 PM // 23:42

Prot Spirit
Spirit Bond
DKiss
Infuse
Convert Hexes
Aegis
ER
AoR

10 heals
10 prot
13 ES

Hale Staff of Enchanting (prot or heal req)

Survivor + minor ES + Vitaes = ~621 hp = stronger Infuses

MercenaryKnight · Jan 06, 2010, 02:47 AM // 02:47

If your running with 1 hero healer+ the er hero then I like to bring heal other instead of infuse health. Odds are most of the time you won't need a 200+ heal and having the ai always healing/ protecting the er who is losing the health sucks for the most part.

Malician · Jan 06, 2010, 08:41 AM // 08:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercenaryKnight

If your running with 1 hero healer+ the er hero then I like to bring heal other instead of infuse health. Odds are most of the time you won't need a 200+ heal and having the ai always healing/ protecting the er who is losing the health sucks for the most part.

Heal other and Jamei's Gaze have a very long cast time (two sec w/ aftercast) and a recharge.

They seem to work pretty well, though. I think they're a viable (but probably inferior overall) replacement for infuse on a hero.

Amy Awien · Jan 06, 2010, 11:27 AM // 11:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

When playing with hench?
What hench is going to be better than the two monks, the mesmer and the earth hench?

The necro hench with blood ritual?

The Josip · Jan 06, 2010, 12:41 PM // 12:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

The necro hench with blood ritual?

Tried it, and his hp sacrifice gets him/her killed a lot.
I will give it a second try but my builds are usually energy-optimized so extra energy for henchie monk..dunno. Also, im pretty sure monk heals sacrificer even before he uses life stealing skill so were going in circles.

HigherMinion · Jan 06, 2010, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

Tried it, and his hp sacrifice gets him/her killed a lot.
I will give it a second try but my builds are usually energy-optimized so extra energy for henchie monk..dunno. Also, im pretty sure monk heals sacrificer even before he uses life stealing skill so were going in circles.

It's not the sacrifice that kills her; it's the running into frontline to give energy.

By the way @Upier.

When I play H/H, I am successful with:

ER hero
Paragon command buffz0rs
MB
Healer hench
Warrior hench
other war hench if possible
ranger hench, para hench if possible.

Why do you need so much defense?

upier · Jan 06, 2010, 06:04 PM // 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

By the way @Upier.

When I play H/H, I am successful with:

ER hero
Paragon command buffz0rs
MB
Healer hench
Warrior hench
other war hench if possible
ranger hench, para hench if possible.

Why do you need so much defense?

I am guessing you are playing a MoP nuker?

HigherMinion · Jan 06, 2010, 06:48 PM // 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

I am guessing you are playing a MoP nuker?

Indeed, most of the time. And about the E/Mo infuse hero, I don't even micro mine at all, and I still get brilliant results.

upier · Jan 06, 2010, 07:07 PM // 19:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

Indeed, most of the time.

Different playstyles then.
You need your guys to be outputting physical damage (regardless of how small their damage output really is) and I just need for my guys to stay out of the way, buffing and cleaning me while I trash stuff.

Yuna Matsumarui · Jan 07, 2010, 04:40 PM // 16:40

E/mo prot is amazing. one time my entire party wiped except for Zhed. then, he kept himself alive for over 10 minutes (was curious how long he'd stand out) as long as there's no or little enchantment removal they own. never tried it with Infuse though.

konshie · Jan 08, 2010, 01:40 AM // 01:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

By the way, aren't +hp mods better than +energy? Or not in this case? That is, should my EMo be in Radiant and +5+5 staff, or should he go with hp mods?

I was also wondering about this too.

Also, would a E/Mo hero be used better than a human E/Mo player with h/h? In those 4 man parties, it can be hard (and my main character is an ele.)

MercenaryKnight · Jan 08, 2010, 02:28 AM // 02:28

E/mo human would be tons better because you can run the protective bond enchant for yourself/ others and be able to spam infuse all you want since you know how to use the build. Plus if you use physicals you can spam gdw or other support pve spells for them.

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:E/Mo_ER_Infuser

That link will show you the basic for the human build.

HigherMinion · Jan 08, 2010, 07:50 PM // 19:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by konshie

I was also wondering about this too.

Also, would a E/Mo hero be used better than a human E/Mo player with h/h? In those 4 man parties, it can be hard (and my main character is an ele.)

Running ER in h/h is tedious and slow, because you have to call, aggro, run back and heal. Not ideal.

In a team of mostly players, you can navigate easier and it's fun to run.

As a human, I run with full Attunment/radiant, +5e, 20% ench spear and +15e-1 on the focus.

Should have about 120e. I think at one point I had 170e with Morale and cons. It's easier the more energy you have because of the energy spikes from Prot Bond. Also, when solo bonding all 8 players i'd advise you to either bring candy and a grail, or red rock candy.

Also, for a player build. Elemental Lord and Mindbender fail.

Yasmine · Jan 27, 2010, 02:52 PM // 14:52

A little question: E/Mo hero protter pvx pages tells to set the hero to guard, but I confess I don't get the reason behind that

Xenomortis · Jan 27, 2010, 03:33 PM // 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yasmine

A little question: E/Mo hero protter pvx pages tells to set the hero to guard, but I confess I don't get the reason behind that

If you set heroes to avoid combat and run into melee range, they tend to follow you. This is bad. When set to guard they tend to attack what you attack at range (provided they have a ranged weapon).

This isn't an issue for casters obviously.